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View Full Version : TOP 70 DC CHARACTERS, PART 2: #50-31


Jon Hancock
Feb 13, 2005, 09:18 pm
<img src="http://www.comixfan.com/xfan/images/columns/top70dccharacters/Top70DCCharacters.jpg" align=left border=0 alt="Top 70 DC Characters">Part 2: #50-31

By: Raul Grau, Alex Groff, Jon Hancock, Matt Lazorwitz, Robin Lewis, Jordan T. Maxwell, Dylan McKay and Ann Nichols
Editor: Jon Hancock

Characters are everything when it comes to story. Without characters you’re left with some nice scenery that would look good as a calendar in a toilet, but makes for a lousy comic. Characters within comics are a special breed. They earn such attention and admiration that many readers will follow a character rather than a writer or story. How many times was Dickens asked to introduce Oliver Twist in the Pickwick Papers? How many times did Shakespeare receive death threats for killing off Romeo and Juliet? Comic fans know what characters they like and so do staff members on comic websites.

For the second instalment celebrating DC’s wide and varied character base you can expect to find a wabbit, a Baptist minister, Sylvester Stallone, an antiques dealer and J.K. Rowling’s favourite character (allegedly)

If you've only just joined us then feel free to check what you've missed in Part 1 (http://www.comixfan.com/xfan/forums/showthread.php?t=32275) of the column

But enough with the teasers and meaningless prattle. Ladies and gentlemen, ComiX-Fan’s staff proudly presents the second instalment of The Top 70 DC Characters Of All Time starting at #50


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#50 Daffy Duck

<img src="http://www.comixfan.com/xfan/images/columns/top70dccharacters/50.jpg" align=left alt="Daffy Duck">First Appearance: Porky’s Duck Hunt
Created By: Tex Avery and Mel Blanc

Daffy is second only to Bugs Bunny as a Looney Tunes character, and how bitterly he resents that! He once blew himself up in a Vaudeville act just to prove he was greater than Bugs. Daffy is conceited, self-centred, impatient, and, as he admits himself, a greedy, craven little coward. Yet it is these unlikeable qualities that make him so endearing. Perhaps that's because his worst plots usually backfire often finding Daffy at the prey of scenery and circumstance as much as his own ineptitude. Daffy’s allure is added to by his fantastic parodies of pulp heroes: Duck Dodgers, Duck Twacy, Dripalong Daffy, Robin Hood Daffy, Dorlock Holmes, etc all show the characters relentless drive towards fame and acceptance. Yet as a hero, those in distress are better off looking to his sidekick, Porky Pig. Usually Daffy is saved by a combination of Porky and luck rather than his own skill. If Porky doesn't come to the rescue, a certain amount of cunning and dumb luck will have to do. It seems his guardian angel is overdue for a nervous breakdown. Daffy found himself firmly rooted in the DCU when he was made a member of the Green Lantern Corps. A scarier thought than him having that much power is hard to imagine. The universe may yet regret that they didn't settle for giving him a replica ring and a key to the executive washroom. A big Daffy Duck fan (the author’s sister) was asked what makes Daffy so great. She replied, "He's funny. That's all he needs to be." Given the sheer amount of gloom and doom in most comics, the ability to make people laugh is a mighty power indeed.

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#49 Delirium

<img src="http://www.comixfan.com/xfan/images/columns/top70dccharacters/49.jpg" align=left alt="Delirium">First Appearance: Sandman #21
Created by: Neil Gaiman and Mike Dringenberg

Delirium isn’t just insane. She is insanity. Her words dance about in multi coloured balloons like a mix between avant-garde poetry, a child’s wide eyed wonderment and a crack addict coming down from a bad trip. She is the embodiment of madness. Not just the lunacy of mental patients, but the mad frenetic energy of poets, the grey eyed ramblings of drug addicts and the homeless, the dancing and innocent joy of a child…and the corruption of that innocence with discovery. Because Delirium was once Delight, youngest of the seven Endless. Older than gods and stars, but eternally the little sister. It is her tragedy and her triumph because she knows things that are not in her older brother Destiny’s dusty book. She imagines things that would rival the wonders of the kingdom of her brother Dream and her embrace is often the one to encompass the lost souls left ravaged by her siblings Desire and Despair. Despite the dysfunctions of her family, she is the most loyal and affectionate of the seven...for better or worse. While her relationship with Death is endearing and her innocent lunacy is a wonderful foil to Dream’s stuffed up pretension, it is her quest to reunite with prodigal brother Destruction that leads Dream to the act that would destroy him. Whether creating chocolate lovers, forgetting words that never existed, learning how to drive or coming up with ice cream flavours, there is great joy in the character of the infectious variety. In her insane ramblings are great truths and revelations (“I knew it was going to be in the last place I looked for it, so I looked there first.”). We love Delirium for her joy and her sadness, her innocence and her corruption, but most of all because she is fun and true. She is the madness that gives sense to the method.

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#48 Jenny Sparks

<img src="http://www.comixfan.com/xfan/images/columns/top70dccharacters/48.jpg" align="left" alt="Jenny Sparks">First Appearance: Stormwatch #37
Created by: Warren Ellis and Tom Raney

The twentieth century was a violent era of change and discovery. An era of contradiction…war to bring about peace, violence to bring about freedom, cynical idealism, passionate apathy. Jenny Sparks was the Spirit of the Twentieth Century. And whether she embodied that contradiction or merely reflected it, she was a wonder to behold. Born at the turn of the century along with a handful of other destined protectors of this planet (such as Planetary’s Elijah Snow), Jenny stopped aging on her twentieth birthday. But she didn’t stop living. She drank hard, chain smoked, slept around, cursed like a sailor and saved more worlds than this one. This girl was electric…literally! She was a Golden Age crime fighter in the 30s, a Spirit like pulp detective in the 40s and a science fiction adventurer in the 50s. A brief stint in the 60s as an underground writer a la Crumb gave way to her founding a Kirbyesque super team that failed. A similar attempt in the 80s fell apart due to the darkness and paranoia of the Watchmen era. And in the 90s, she was found drowning her sorrows in shots of liquor by Henry Bendix who recruited her for his revamped Stormwatch. Jenny was a superhero again (though she’s always preferred her white suits to the “spandex body condom things” of tradition) and she wanted to change the world. She had been witness to the evolution of the genre and served as the mouthpiece for a kind of British cynicism and skepticism towards traditional superheroes. In the wake of Stormwatch’s destruction, on the cusp of a new millenium, Jenny formed a new kind of team for a new kind of world: The Authority. She died at midnight at the end of the century, having saved the world and through the Authority changed it forever…for better or worse.

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#47 Black Lightning (Jefferson Pierce)

<img src="http://www.comixfan.com/xfan/images/columns/top70dccharacters/47.jpg" align=left alt="Black Lightning (Jefferson Pierce)">First Appearance: Black Lightning (1st series) #1
Created by: Tony Isabella and Trevor Von Eeden

In the 1970's, Blaxploitation was huge. DC's answer was going to be the Black Bomber, a racist character that was everything DC's first African-American hero, starring in his own solo title, shouldn't be. Bringing Marvel writer Tony Isabella in to get the character to work led to the sane decision being reached, scraping the whole idea and starting from scratch, under time constraints, a hero to be proud of emerged, Black Lighting. Jefferson Pierce differed from the typical blaxploitation hero. He wasn't a jive talkin' bad mutha. Well he was, as Black Lightning, but not as Jefferson Pierce. See, he was one of the first heroes to realize that having different speech patterns in civilian and in costumed life was an effective tool in protecting his identity. And that was just the first time Jefferson Pierce deviated from the typical. Black Lightning was just the third hero to refuse membership in the Justice League of America and later became a founding member of the Outsiders. In recent times he accepted a position as Secretary of Education in Lex Luthor's cabinet, surviving as the superhero community's insider voice whilst also fighting for what he believes in most, the future of others. He worked tirelessly, albeit without success, to prevent his daughter, Thunder, from taking up the life of a costumed hero. Jefferson hoped that she would fight for justice in a way that would not need such a high price. Proud, noble, honorable, aware of the injustices of the African-American community, but not a one note character. Jefferson Pierce is willing to be different in his hopes to make a difference and in doing so laid the groundwork for characters like Cyborg, John Stewart, Mr. Terrific and countless other dynamic African-American DC heroes.

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#46 Hawkman (Carter Hall)

<img src="http://x-mencomics.com/xfan/images/columns/top70dccharacters/46.jpg" align=left alt="Hawkman (Carter Hall)">First Appearance: Flash Comics #1
Created by: Gardner Fox and Dennis Neville

Hawkman started off as an innocent hero with wings and a mace. He had roots in Egyptian mythology and was the reincarnated soul of an Egyptian Prince. Along the way there was also some confusion around reincarnated alien policemen and lost loves. So why does this guy deserve a place here? Hawkman’s personality is one of unabashed machismo. While other heroes try and be cool, he’s just genuinely scary. His extreme approach to justice, coupled with his mastery of arcane, brutal weapons make his silly hawk helmet a whole lot more intimidating. He looks like he’s going to swoop down and use the beak to rip your eyes out. He was the first person to be in both Justice League and Justice Society and was the only ever present member of the All-Star Squadron. His leadership skills command him respect from the hero community the likes of which is usually reserved for Batman and Superman. Carter is the hero’s hero. Carter is just a guy with wings and a mace, yet he hangs with the strongest and most powerful heroes in the world due to his valiant nature and unrivalled bravery. His relationship with the Atom is a truly unique one as his hard headed, larger than life warrior, somehow compliments the Atom’s straight thinking scientific method. Carter’s uniqueness comes from the fact he is one of the most ferocious and vicious of DC’s characters despite his roots in the schmaltzy days of DC’s Golden Age. This alone warrants his place in this list.

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#45 Judge Dredd (Joe Dredd)

<img src="http://x-mencomics.com/xfan/images/columns/top70dccharacters/45.jpg" align=left alt="Judge Dredd (Joe Dredd)">First appearance: 2000AD Prog #2
Created by John Wagner, Pat Mills and Carlos Ezquerra

No figure stands taller in the world of British comics than Judge Joe Dredd. Top lawman in a future America dominated by sprawling Mega-Cities, Dredd is a paragon of duty, a brutal exponent of applied violence, a protector of his city, and a borderline fascist. No comic character from any universe comes close in terms of dedication, single-mindedness and toughness. He's been stabbed, shot, crushed, immolated, drowned, strangled, tortured and otherwise upset. A clone whose only love is the law and whose only reward is the satisfaction of duty, Judge Dredd has saved his city on countless occasions, been responsible for the deaths of over a billion people (most of them during the Apocalypse War, in which he nuked a city foolish enough to have invaded his own) and stalked the streets of his beloved home for decades dealing justice with a daystick and dispensing punishment with the coolest gun ever made. His stories have been by turns exciting, satiric, bleak, hysterically funny and touching. He is the law, and you better believe it.

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#44 Starman (Jack Knight)

<img src="http://www.comixfan.com/xfan/images/columns/top70dccharacters/44.jpg" align="left" alt="Starman (Jack Knight)">First Appearance: Zero Hour: Crisis In Time! #1
Created by: James Robinson and Tony Harris

Jack Knight cared more about finding choice pieces of Heywood Wakefield furniture than he ever did about the silly little game of dress-up called superheroism. Harnessing unbelievable energies to stop pickpockets was the world of his father, and the aspiration of his brother... for Jack, life was great as long as the View-Master reels kept pouring in. A single gunshot changed all that, leaving Opal City without a Starman. The role fell upon Jack, and he acquiesced, first out of desire for vengeance, then out of parental loyalty, but always with his own style. Gone were the gaudy costume and head fin, this Starman needed only a cosmic rod, a leather jacket (quite cold in the sky), and a pair of tank goggles (that rod gets mighty bright). Along the way, he made friends, enemies, friends out of enemies, and, occasionally, enemies out of friends. In the end, Jack willingly retired from costume life, but not before finally admitting that he had enjoyed the adventure. Obviously, this Starman was a different breed of superhero. He eschewed spandex, adopting a personal look which mixed 50s retro with 90s slacker. Jack had tea with villains, and would avoid a fight when he could, especially if he could make a sale instead. However, he embodied the nobility of heroism, always willing to lay down his life for the people of Opal. With Jack Knight, James Robinson reinterpreted the modern hero, abandoning the pretence, but keeping the core. Most amazingly, when his story was over, Jack quietly passed his rod to another. Frankly, I would love to see Superman or Batman retire from crime fighting to care for their illegitimate son.

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#43 Flash (Jay Garrick)

<img src="http://www.comixfan.com/xfan/images/columns/top70dccharacters/43.jpg" align="left" alt="Flash (Jay Garrick)">First Appearance: Flash Comics #1
Created by: Gardner Fox and Harry Lampert

Wally West may be the current titleholder, but from 1939 until 1951, Jay Garrick was the Fastest Man Alive! However, being the first of the Flash lineage is not the only record held by this racer. The current glut of super speedsters populating our fictional worlds can all be traced back to Jay, who was the first to fight crime with fleet feet. Almost immediately after his 'hard water' experiment went so horribly right, he broke standard heroic form by telling his girlfriend of his newfound abilities. The first chairman of the Justice Society of America, Jay proved popular enough to earn his own solo title (the aptly named All-Flash), something only Superman and Batman had done before him. Though his titles and team faded with the post-war decline of superheroes, Jay was the first DC hero to spawn a successor, ensuring his eventual legacy. His inheritor, Barry Allen, was the starting pistol for a new heroic age, providing Jay with the means to be the first Golden Ager to return. Today, Jay Garrick remains as active as ever, serving with the renamed JSA and acting as a respected mentor to the two generations of superheroes who followed. Most amazingly, he has even managed to maintain a marriage for nearly sixty years, putting all other wedded wonders to shame. All who ride the lighting are merely following in the footsteps of Jay Garrick, the Fastest Octogenarian Alive!

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#42 Doctor Manhattan (Dr. Jonathan Osterman)

<img src="http://www.comixfan.com/xfan/images/columns/top70dccharacters/42.jpg" align="left" alt="Doctor Manhattan (Dr. Jonathan Osterman)">First Appearance: Watchmen #1
Created by: Alan Moore and Dave Gibbons

One of the most well known expressions in comics’ history is, "With great power comes great responsibility.” But what exactly is that responsibility? In Dr. Manhattan we see that much of that responsibility may be towards inaction. His presence not only revolutionized super heroics in a world where costumed vigilantes had no powers, but revolutionized everything from the automotive industry to international politics and the global balance of power. "God exists and he's American." The ways that he can change the world are immeasurable, not even by him, and as such, he must be incredibly careful of everything he does. He may have the power of a god, but he does not have the omniscience. Dr. Manhattan experiences time simultaneously; as opposed to in a linear fashion, and as such, his actions reflect what he views as the pre-ordained future. Never questioning time or his actions, it is the only way he can live with the power at his disposal. Often times the most common criticism of over-powered superheroes is that the reader cannot relate to the character, but in Dr. Manhattan, we see the inverse is also true, how can a being of such immense power relate to the world around him? What can ground a being who can see people on the atomic level and to whom changes in the natural world are perceived the same as changes in human emotion? Dr. Manhattan earns his place by being the most well thought out and realistic portrayal of the practical realities of being the most powerful entity on the planet.

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#41 Adam Strange

<img src="http://x-mencomics.com/xfan/images/columns/top70dccharacters/41.jpg" align=left alt="Adam Strange">First Appearance: Showcase #17
Created by: Gardner Fox and Mike Sekowsky

Adam Strange is Flash Gordon with an advanced degree in archaeology. He is a normal man who stumbled upon a grand adventure. Rann may not have been the world of his birth, but there he found love, family, a home, a purpose, and a destiny. As a man, Adam is a hero, nobly sacrificing his own safety countless times over, all in the service of his adopted homeworld. However, as a concept, he is far more. Adam Strange harkens back to the pulp roots of comic literature. When DC revamped their Golden Age concepts as modern heroes, they were reborn in science fiction clothing. A chemical rich Flash, Green Lantern with an extraterrestrial ring, a Hawkman from another planet, an Atom utilizing the power of a fallen star, and then came Adam Strange. A typical man cast in his very own space opera, Adam Strange is an Amazing Stories cover brought to life as a superhero. Every appearance he makes today, in an era when sci-fi is defined by the level of CGI, helps keep those pulp sensibilities alive. Adam Strange embodies the very core of science fiction, and he never even needed a codename to accomplish that.

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#40 Zatanna (Zatanna Zatara)

<img src="http://www.comixfan.com/xfan/images/columns/top70dccharacters/40.jpg" align="left">First Appearance: Hawkman #4
Created by: Gardner Fox, Julius Schwartz, and Murphy Anderson

As the daughter of a Golden Age stage magician/crimefighter, Zatanna, the first gender-swapped successor, seemed destined for uniqueness. To start with her beginnings, she has the distinction of starring in the first multi-title comic book crossover. Zatanna's Search (as it has retroactively been dubbed) spanned four series and three years before coming to rest in Justice League of America. She would later return to that title as their first mystical member, holding her own even alongside that other, second-generational fishnet-clad heroine. Arguably their most powerful member, her abilities would ebb and flow as her writers saw fit, before she was abandoned to the limbo of guest stardom. Still, Zatanna persevered, appearing in every book that would allow her top hat. Her relationships with Vertigo characters (very intimate relationships, in some cases) bridge the gap between the two imprints, blending adult mysticism and superheroics into one, leggy package.
Identity Crisis further raised her profile, transforming Zatanna into the most feared character in her universe, at least among heroes and villains who particularly like keeping their memories intact. Of course, everyone would love the power to effect change simply by talking backwards, tub ti ylno smees ot krow rof reh.

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#39 Ra’s al Ghul

<img src="http://www.comixfan.com/xfan/images/columns/top70dccharacters/39.jpg" align=left alt="Ra's Al Ghul">First Appearance: Batman #232
Created by: Denny O’Neil and Neal Adams

Ra’s al Ghul is a man who wears many faces. He is a father, he is the master of the League of Assassins, he is an eco-terrorist, he is an immortal. Using his Lazarus Pits, a combination of alchemy and mystic lay lines, Ra’s has lived through the centuries and watched the world slowly crumble due to the depredations of man. It was his decision that the only way to stop this was to wipe out ninety percent of humanity. This goal has brought him into conflict on many occasions with the Batman. Ra’s would sooner have Batman as his heir, marrying his daughter Talia, helping to bring about Ra’s apocalyptic visions. But this is not to be, and so Ra’s has become one of Batman’s most cunning and deadly adversaries. As opposed to the usual breed of psychotic that the Dark Knight faces, Ra’s is cool, calculating, and always one step ahead, ready with a legion of underlings and his own sword if the battle reaches that point. He has teamed with many of Batman’s other foes, and has bedevilled the Dark Knight for some time. Ra’s is one of the few villains to come from the seventies who has had lasting effect on the Batman mythos, created by the legendary team of Bat guru Denny O’Neil and comics legend Neal Adams. In recent years, he has gone as far as being a threat not only to Batman, but to the entire JLA. And though he died in Batman: Death and the Maidens, with his upcoming appearance in Batman Begins, we may still see more of Ra’s al Ghul.


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#38 Animal Man (Buddy Baker)

<img src="http://x-mencomics.com/xfan/images/columns/top70dccharacters/38.jpg" align=left alt="Animal Man (Buddy Baker)">First Appearance: Strange Adventures #180 (1965)
Created by: Dave Wood and Carmine Infantino
Reimagined by: Grant Morrison and Chas Truog

When a character's most memorable appearance in two decades is as part of a superhero team named The Forgotten Heroes, one really has to wonder how important that character is. I mean, let's face it, Animal Man? A guy whose great ability puts him on par with fleas and porcupines? Riiight. A lesser writer would have broken down and cried when DC handed him or her the reins to a book so obviously the brain child of psychedelic drugs and the Animal Planet. But not Grant Morrison. No. As someone well-acquainted with both psychotropic substances and animal rights causes, Morrison turned Buddy Baker from a spandex-clad punch line to a character that represented certain cultural ideas that were gaining credence during the seventies, eighties and nineties. Animal rights, vegetarianism, the relationship between man and animal, man and the earth, man and commercialism-- these all became a part of Buddy Baker's multifaceted character. Buddy Baker is a family man, married with two children, who tries on his costume again as a way of beating unemployment and winds up facing the realities of animal abuse, the excesses of activism, the brutality of reactionary corporations, and the suffering caused simply by being human. In an era of realistic comics a la Dark Knight Returns, Animal Man managed to combine innocence, naiveté, and in the end, hope. If comics had need of a patron saint for lost causes, it would be Buddy Baker-- a character who began as a lost cause himself.

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#37 Jesse Custer

<img src=" http://x-mencomics.com/xfan/images/columns/top70dccharacters/37.jpg" align=left alt="Jesse Custer">First Appearance: Preacher #1
Created by: Garth Ennis and Steve Dillon

Jesse Custer was a disillusioned Texan preacher whose congregation was mysteriously killed when a mysterious power entered him. Jesse began a search for God, hoping to find out why he had received this entity. Along the way he confronted his abusive childhood and managed to foil a global conspiracy to replace all the world’s leaders. Jesse’s story is one of love, inner searching, revenge, friendship and betrayal. Jesse is more than a cool anti hero. He is an everyman who strives to understand his history and his spirituality within the context of the life that he is presented with. Whether he is confiding in the ghost of John Wayne or dealing with betrayal from his best friends, Jesse’s tale nurtures the reader’s emotions as well as tickling their funny bone. Jesse deserves his place on this list because he is not only ridiculously cool, but you can take him at whatever level of entertainment you want. Whether that is a gripping commentary on relationships, a deep exploration of someone’s spiritual motivations or an action packed, non stop ride is up to you. The only constant is quality comics.

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#36 V

<img src=" http://x-mencomics.com/xfan/images/columns/top70dccharacters/36.jpg" align=left alt="V">First appearance: Warrior #1
Created by: Alan Moore and David Lloyd

Anarchist. Criminal. Terrorist. Not the words you would typically expect to describe a hero…particularly when he describes himself as the villain. But such is the brilliant ambiguity of V. He is both champion and criminal, terrorist and freedom fighter, psychotic and visionary, standing as the lone force of opposition against a fascist regime. Driven insane by the government experiments that left him a superhuman specimen, V has a charming eccentricity about him. He dresses like Guy Fawkes and is as likely to quote Macbeth as Motown. Yet that insanity has granted him a certain clarity and a deeply dangerous intelligence hidden behind his eerie porcelain smile, almost as deadly as his bombs and knives (and fingers…it’s best not to discuss it). The weapons at V’s disposal are multifaceted. He can kill you up close with a dagger. He can kill you from afar with plastique. He can kill you with the delicious irony of a communion wafer. He can drive you insane, manipulate you…or set you free (or, in the case of poor sweet Evey, all three). In short, he can do anything he wants and what he wants is to set people free from the yoke of fascism with the bombs and poetry of sweet, sweet anarchy. For all his incredible physical prowess and mental agility, for all the delights of his moral ambiguity, the most important aspect of V is his philosophy. In his words, we find great wisdom, cleverness and truth. He was written as a reflection of a dark and troubled period…and in today’s world where the lines between terror, tyranny and freedom are so blurred, he is more relevant than ever. His villainy destroys our oppressors. His heroism sets us free. Oh, and he helped get Alan Moore noticed and hired by DC. That’s got to count for something.

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#35 Brainiac

<img src="http://x-mencomics.com/xfan/images/columns/top70dccharacters/35.jpg" align=left alt="Brainiac">First Appearance: Action Comics #242 (1958)
Created by: Al Plastino & Curt Swan

There's a lot of back story to Brainiac (from 1958 to the 64th century, to be exact), but at the heart of it is a villain whose uber-intelligence is only matched by his disregard for human life. In his first appearance, he shrunk most major world cities. He never did get around to enlarging Kandor, the only remaining city from Superman's home world of Krypton.* Since then, he has taken over Metropolis, killed Jimmy Olson and Lana Lang, nearly killed Superman multiple times, attempted to overtake Earth2, taken over Metropolis again, and so on. He has been an alien named Vril Dox, a robot named Brainiac, a clone, a robot named Brainiac 2, a human being named Milton Fine; he's now a robot again, #12 or #13. Or, you ask? Well, he was Brainiac #13, but then Superman went into the future and prevented #13 from being created in the past. Yes, you read that correctly. Continuity, as they say, be damned.... With a history that confusing, its a good thing he's smart. But just how intelligent is Brainiac, you ask? The finest Brainiac story I've read was Superman's Dead Again storyline, when Superman finally defeated Brainiac. Unwilling to admit defeat, Brainiac convinced himself that he was still Milton Fine, the circus magician whose body Brainiac inhabited. By convincing himself that he was someone else, Brainiac could never lose another battle. Imagine the brainpower required to convince yourself that you are someone else-- to literally hide within yourself. It was a fine ending to a fine villain... until he came back again.

*This event occurred pre-Crisis. The post-Crisis story of Kandor is... confusing, to say the least. See here (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kandor) for more information.

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#34 Tim Hunter

<img src="http://www.comixfan.com/xfan/images/columns/top70dccharacters/34.jpg" align="left" alt="Tim Hunter"> First Appearance: Books of Magic #1
Created by: Neil Gaiman and John Bolton

Long before Harry Potter ever picked up a broom, there was Tim Hunter. A normal brown-haired, bespectacled, thirteen year old British boy, who is suddenly confronted with the rather unsettling news that the world is an infinitely stranger place than he could ever have imagined. Magic exists, his parents are not really his parents, and he has the potential to be the greatest mage of his time... quite a bit to lay on a thirteen year old. He quickly learns that mysticism cannot be measured by the number of rabbits pulled from hats... magic is the unseen world functioning parallel to our own, it is a curse always threatening to destroy those who dare to harness it, it is beauty transcendent, it is inside him, and it will never let him go. Neil Gaiman broke every standard of what a wizard should be with the creation of Tim. No white beards, starry robes, or pointy wands here... not even a trench coat and a nicotine habit. Tim is just a boy, learning about life as he learns about magic. He flirted, stumbled, and wept like any other adolescent, with his abilities as much a help as a hindrance. Even now, living a Life During Wartime, Tim remains Tim- desperate to reclaim that lost normalcy, but amazed by the true wonders he unlocks. Plus, he never lowered himself to nonsense-speaking, robe-wearing, wand-waving clichés like certain other pampered boy mages you might have heard of.

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#33 Darkseid (Uxas)

<img src="http://x-mencomics.com/xfan/images/columns/top70dccharacters/33.jpg" align=left alt="Darkseid (Uxas)">First Appearance: Superman’s Pal Jimmy Olsen #134
Created by: Jack Kirby

Lord and master of the despotic hell hole that is Apokolips, Darkseid rules with an iron fist, dominant over all. Feared by every creature and hero within the DC Universe, Darkseid is immortal and all powerful. However, there is more to the character than his immense power. Darkseid’s constant quest for knowledge and power is a calculated one rather than the hair brained schemes or shows of force often seen by would-be world conquerors. Darkseid is rarely outwitted or out fought and when he is then you can be sure he will gain vengeance. He has no comparables, no equals, no betters. Darkseid represents all that is evil within Jack Kirby’s dualistic Fourth World Saga. Twisting and torturing each of his subjects to earn their loyalty. Darkseid’s importance is such that whenever he appears in a comic, the hero’s situation instantly becomes hopeless. Immensely powerful and yet intensely cerebral, Darkseid is the ultimate villain. His appearance is dominating, commanding and hope sucking. Darkseid rules over a hell of depression and he does so with pleasure.

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#32 Robin (Tim Drake)

<img src="http://www.comixfan.com/xfan/images/columns/top70dccharacters/32.jpg" align=left alt="Robin (Tim Drake)">First Appearance: Batman #436
Created by: Marv Wolfman and Pat Broderick

Tim Drake is not the first Robin, but he is a different one from the previous two in many ways. A witness to the death of the Flying Graysons, Tim used his clever young mind to deduce the identities of Batman and Robin. When Batman began to lose his grip following the death of Jason Todd, Tim hunted down Dick Grayson to try to get him to help. Dick told him that he wouldn’t come back as Robin and so Tim was offered the chance to be a hero. And he took it. Not because of some dark past or a death of a family member, but because it was the right thing to do. Tim learned to be a hero slowly, and readers of the Bat titles watched it happen. Unlike other Robins, Tim wasn’t a natural fighter or athlete. He was a thinker, a computer hacker and a detective who had to try hard to follow Batman’s physical regimen. After his initial appearance, it was a year before he donned his own version of the Robin costume and went out into the world. Tim would get three mini-series before getting an honor no previous Robin had, his own monthly series. And he has continued to grow. Readers have watched him deal with the death of his mother, his father’s slow recovery from illness, and his new stepmother. Tim has found first love, and lost it, and found someone new to be with. And recently, his life has been full of tragedy. His father has died, a victim of Jean Loring’s machinations, and Spoiler, his once girlfriend, was killed by Black Mask. And yet he perseveres. Robin, Tim Drake, is a hero above all else, and his future holds much promise.

<center><hr width=75%></center>

#31 Bugs Bunny

<img src="http://www.comixfan.com/xfan/images/columns/top70dccharacters/31.jpg" align=left alt="Bugs Bunny">First Appearance: “Porky’s Hare Hunt”
Created by: Cal Dalton, ‘Bugs’ Hardaway and Mel Blanc

Bugs Bunny differs from your conventional superhero. He has no powers, aside from the ability to conjure up necessary objects out of thin air (or command fabulously quick service through letters or ads) and his continuity is that of character. Bugs is recognizably Bugs no matter what setting you drop him into, be it a hole in the forest, Wagner's "Ring of the Nibelugan", or a stage ready for a performance of "The Barber of Seville". The grey rabbit is a hero for all the ordinary people because he stands up for himself, and smaller, weaker creatures, against bigger, stupider or more powerful foes. He tends to be minding his own business until someone comes along to shove a gun in his face or threaten something he holds dear. Whose heart doesn't beat faster in anticipation when Bugs utters those famous words, "Of course you know, this means war?" Bugs is a master of disguise with a deep knowledge of human nature, which he uses to hilarious effect. No proper man would do anything other than slam the door, stammer an apology, and slink shamefacedly away if he finds an apparent woman taking a bubble bath and "she" screams at him. Although his casual, "Eh, what's up, Doc?", in a threatening situation shows his courage, when it comes to escaping, Bugs has no shame. He makes a convincing coward or lovely lady. His motto might as well be, "Whatever it takes." Fortunately for us, whatever it takes is hugely entertaining.

Join us next time for moments #11-30, and watch ComiX-Fan all month long for more anniversary goodness! (http://www.comixfan.com/xfan/forums/showthread.php?t=32203)


#34, 40, 41, 43, 44: Raul Grau
#33, 37, 46: Jon Hancock
#36, 48, 49: Jordan T. Maxwell
#35, 38: Alex Groff
#32, 39: Matt Lazorwitz
#42, 47: Dylan McKay
#31, 50: Ann Nichols
#45: Robin Lewis
Editor: Jon Hancock
Columns Editor: Joel Phillips
Editor in Chief: Al Harahap
Co-Publisher: Brian Wilkinson
Publisher: Eric J. Moreels


<center>All characters, titles, and likenesses thereof ™ © DC Comics (http://www.dccomics.com) or its licensors,
and are used without permission, not for profit. All other content © original author and ComiX-Fan (http://www.comixfan.com/xfan).</center>

Jonathan Payson
Feb 13, 2005, 10:47 pm
Y'know, I'm not that big on most DC (Although I'll read anything Gail Simone or Judd Winnick put out), but there's no bloody way that Bugs is cooler than Daffy. Fun list this, though. It actually has me interested in checking out some DC stuff.

Jon Hancock
Feb 13, 2005, 10:53 pm
And thus my work is done :). Seriously, if more people get interested in the characters then it's a bonus for comics.

The list's aren't just ranked on coolness though. Personal preference goes alongside fame, longevity, iconic status and tons of other stuff. I think both are worthy of their place and Bugs being higher makes sense.

CrazyFool83
Feb 14, 2005, 01:18 am
Gotta heavily disagree with putting Judge Dredd on that list. He may be a great character, but DC's had the rights to him for what, a year? And that's the key: Rights to publish in the U.S. They don't own teh character and thus to me, he's not a DC Character and shouldn't be on the list.

Qubic
Feb 14, 2005, 02:18 am
Good list so far but I would like to see the year that these characters were created but thats not that big of a deal and Daffy Duck is the great, Duck Dodgers is so funny. Looking forward the the next list.

Jordan T. Maxwell
Feb 14, 2005, 04:08 am
Gotta heavily disagree with putting Judge Dredd on that list. He may be a great character, but DC's had the rights to him for what, a year? And that's the key: Rights to publish in the U.S. They don't own teh character and thus to me, he's not a DC Character and shouldn't be on the list.

we decided at the very beginning of this event that we would include ALL DC imprints in consideration of this list. whether DC owns them or not, they are characters published by DC. Judge Dredd is now published by DC. thus he is a DC character. Jim Lee still retains the rights to many of his Wildstorm characters, yet they are still DC characters. Brian K. Vaughan owns the rights to all of his characters from Y the Last Man and Ex Machina, two different titles under two different imprints...published by DC. they are DC characters. we did not discriminate on how long DC has published them or if DC was the first to publish them. so V is eligible for the list. Bugs and Daffy have existed for years without ever appearing in a DC comic, but now that they are it is in DC comics. so at the very least in their comics incarnations, they are DC characters. these are the criteria we set out at the beginning and if we hadn't, we'd have a lot of people saying "well, where's Judge Dredd? Where's Jesse Custer? Where's Jenny Sparks? aren't they all technically DC characters?" can't please everyone...so we tried to please everyone. ;)

oh, but i do agree that Judge Dredd doesn't belong on this list. but only because i don't personally think he's that great a character. :p

Robin Lewis
Feb 14, 2005, 08:27 am
Jordan, you are wrong. With just a blackboard and a piece of chalk I can prove to you mathamatically that Judge Dredd is, in fact, a truly great character.

tormented_spawn
Feb 14, 2005, 09:03 am
Well, with this chalk and this piece of chocolate, I could prove otherwise... sorry, had to say some smart ass comment...

Is Black Lightning is the DC's Black Pather? I don't hate Judge Dread, don't like him, but how can he (and also Zatanna, who is she anyway? Is it the stockings that attract you guys to her?) beat the likes of Jenny Sparks? While, I like Teen Titans and Robin is good character, though the beat hard drinking, ass kicking, Jesse Cluster?

bravelybravesirrobin
Feb 14, 2005, 09:07 am
Tim Hunter!

Tim bloody Hunter!

and you rank him higher than Jenny Sparks, JESSE CUSTER, BUDDY BAKER, starman doc metropolis and V!!!!

I don't even like V (well it's better than a lot of comics but Moore's weakest work by far) but he's a far more complex character than dreary bloody hunter.

But now i'm sure loads of people will spring to Tim's defense but really he bores the crap out of me, about the only completely unapproachable character Gaiman has ever worked on (well him and destiny I suppose).


Moving on, some surprisingly lwo spots for great characters here. Surely Bugs is top 10 material just because of his icon status and Buddy Baker, Starman and Jesse Custer are some of the best developed, likeable and interesting heroes to ever appear in comics - I could certainly see them all make top 20.

So they're better be some excellent choices in the next few selections....... or else.

tormented_spawn
Feb 14, 2005, 09:19 am
V for Vendetta? Moore's weakest work? :astound: have you read some of the stuff he wrote for Image & Wildstorm like Voodoo and Deathblow? Yes, there are bad... yes, let's never speak of it again....

bravelybravesirrobin
Feb 14, 2005, 12:19 pm
happily no, i've never heard of them. I narrowly missed the whole image explosion thing.

And thinking on I prefer V to Tom Strong as well and DR and Quitch so I guess I retract that statement.

I jsut don't get the huge fuss over it when it's so reminiscent of 1984 with a happy ending.

DeadmanWade
Feb 14, 2005, 01:28 pm
Good list liking how vertigo charcters are appearing alot on the list. since that is the main thing i read from dc. so GOOOO VERTIGO!!! Go Death! Go Dream! Go Swampy! most of all GOOOO AMBUSH BUG! Wait he's not vertigo...opps :D
Anyways really enjoying the list even though we all know which chars are gonna be on top...just going to be interesting who and why

jojaxx
Feb 14, 2005, 02:00 pm
Wow, this list sure makes up for the 70-51 list.

Good stuff, I retract my earlier complaints about your lists.

Jordan T. Maxwell
Feb 14, 2005, 04:02 pm
Jordan, you are wrong. With just a blackboard and a piece of chalk I can prove to you mathamatically that Judge Dredd is, in fact, a truly great character.

hey, just not a personal fan of the character. then again, i haven't read an incredible amount of his comics. the few i did read didn't exactly make me want to rush out and buy more.


Is Black Lightning is the DC's Black Pather? I don't hate Judge Dread, don't like him, but how can he (and also Zatanna, who is she anyway? Is it the stockings that attract you guys to her?) beat the likes of Jenny Sparks? While, I like Teen Titans and Robin is good character, though the beat hard drinking, ass kicking, Jesse Cluster?

that depends...who the hell is Jesse Cluster? ;) to play devil's advocate, Robin is a far more iconic character than Jesse Custer. a penchant for whiskey and a tendency to solve your problems with head butting only goes so far. :p

Black Lightning is DC's Black Panther in so far as, well, they're both black characters. And they're both into politics. beyond that, i don't see where you're drawing the comparison.

and how much Vertigo have you read that you don't know who Zatanna is? Hey, i love Jenny Sparks and all, but Z takes the cake. :D

Tim Hunter!

Tim bloody Hunter!

[QUOTE=bravelybravesirrobin]
and you rank him higher than Jenny Sparks, JESSE CUSTER, BUDDY BAKER, starman doc metropolis and V!!!!

um...yeah.


I don't even like V (well it's better than a lot of comics but Moore's weakest work by far) but he's a far more complex character than dreary bloody hunter.

okay, well now i KNOW you don't know what you're talking about as V is pound for pound one of Moore's best works.


But now i'm sure loads of people will spring to Tim's defense but really he bores the crap out of me, about the only completely unapproachable character Gaiman has ever worked on (well him and destiny I suppose).

right, the completely unapproachable character who's justified having two mini series and two regular series based solely around him and who helped inspire one of pop cultures most recent phenomena...yep, no one can think of anything to do with that character. :p


Moving on, some surprisingly lwo spots for great characters here. Surely Bugs is top 10 material just because of his icon status.

i disagree. his icon status really only extends so far as his animated incarnation goes. i think we who voted in this event drew a distinct line and said "this is consideration of him as a comic book character and his status as a comic book character." heck, there are lots of characters i'd rather see on this list before Bugs and Daffy, but that's the way the dice fall sometimes.


So they're better be some excellent choices in the next few selections....... or else.

or else what? you'll come back and complain some more? ;)


I jsut don't get the huge fuss over it when it's so reminiscent of 1984 with a happy ending.

how is it in any way reminiscent of 1984? I'm a huge fan of both works and other than taking place in a not so distant dystopic future, i really fail to see any parallels.

Dylan McKay
Feb 14, 2005, 04:31 pm
Anyways really enjoying the list even though we all know which chars are gonna be on top...just going to be interesting who and why

I'll say this, we do have some shockers in the top 10. Not that I disagree, heck I agree with the selections. But there will be alot of people gasping that characters x and y beat character z. You'll know what I mean when we get there...

I personally found V to be somewhat similar to 1984, but WAY cooler. But V himself is completely different from the protagonist in 1984.

bravelybravesirrobin
Feb 14, 2005, 05:01 pm
hey, just not a personal fan of the character. then again, i haven't read an incredible amount of his comics. the few i did read didn't exactly make me want to rush out and buy more.



that depends...who the hell is Jesse Cluster? ;) to play devil's advocate, Robin is a far more iconic character than Jesse Custer. a penchant for whiskey and a tendency to solve your problems with head butting only goes so far. :p

Black Lightning is DC's Black Panther in so far as, well, they're both black characters. And they're both into politics. beyond that, i don't see where you're drawing the comparison.

and how much Vertigo have you read that you don't know who Zatanna is? Hey, i love Jenny Sparks and all, but Z takes the cake. :D



um...yeah.



okay, well now i KNOW you don't know what you're talking about as V is pound for pound one of Moore's best works.



right, the completely unapproachable character who's justified having two mini series and two regular series based solely around him and who helped inspire one of pop cultures most recent phenomena...yep, no one can think of anything to do with that character. :p



i disagree. his icon status really only extends so far as his animated incarnation goes. i think we who voted in this event drew a distinct line and said "this is consideration of him as a comic book character and his status as a comic book character." heck, there are lots of characters i'd rather see on this list before Bugs and Daffy, but that's the way the dice fall sometimes.



or else what? you'll come back and complain some more? ;)



how is it in any way reminiscent of 1984? I'm a huge fan of both works and other than taking place in a not so distant dystopic future, i really fail to see any parallels.



I guess I'll just chalk the Tim thing down to taste but as Starman is one of my favourite comics of all time and as Buddy Baker is the most likeable superhero ever written I guess I was a little.... annoyed that someone I actively dislike beat them both out.


V v 1984

Both are set in england, set in a "near future" at the time of writing deal with an oppressive government that constantly watches you (Moore made a big deal of security cameras appearing, which of course is reality now) uses hatred in order to inspire loyalty and both have a Big Brother figure telling everyone how good the government is all the time.

In both stories the hero is an anarchist (and yes they both are "I hate virtue, I hate purity, I want everyone corrupt" and the promises to kill children etc, etc upon joining the brotherhood clearly mark Wilson out as anarchist) who doesn't so much want to build a new world as much as destroy the current one. V is a very different kind of hero (in that he's Doctor Doom, the intelligent all knowing physical and mental behemoth who hides his face) but he's also a lot less real and engaging because of it (I suppose a case could be amde that as V is jsut a persona that was kind of the point)

The major difference is that V takes on a successor and has a "happy" ending with the anarchy achieved and the possibility of a better world emerging whereas 1984 has a dour ending that doesn't provide a power fantasy and isntead forces the reader to confront his own reality.

There a many subtle differences too (the communist system creates proles and a caste system built on denial whereas the faschists have a more normal undersociety of criminals corrupt coppers and druggies), Moore is no hack and he didn't rip off 1984 by any means but I don't think V says anything new. It's the same themes just with an ending that promises hope.

Don't get me wrong, it's a brilliantly written comic (the piano bit is marvellous) it's intelligent sci-fi, it's well thought out the characterisation is consistently good etc, etc but it lacks the really strong thematic punch that for me makes these early Moore works so brilliant (later Moore of course builds his stories on a Coleridge-esque "pure imagination" trying to recreate the imaginative joys that made him love comics as a child)


Which is all vastly off topic of course, :)


Your point on Bugs as a comic icon v a cartoon icon I completely understand with. Hell on the strength of that argument he could easily be further down the list.


and as for my or else, well what ws I going to threaten you with, a stern talking to?

Ken Boehm
Feb 14, 2005, 06:12 pm
Animal Man is above Hawkman and Jay Garrick? That just doesn't make sense. They were some of the first superheroes. And if we're going to add WB characters, Bugs Bunny would go up there with Superman and Batman in the top 3.

I'm not real fond of all these DC events here, to be honest. Especially with the inclusion of Warner Brothers characters.

I thought this would be just DC, no Vertigo or WB. When Vertigo reaches a big anniversary year I bet we see a Vertigo top something or another. It's a double dip.

Al Harahap
Feb 14, 2005, 07:16 pm
I thought this would be just DC, no Vertigo or WB. When Vertigo reaches a big anniversary year I bet we see a Vertigo top something or another. It's a double dip.

We just missed it. A few months ago was Vertigo's 10th anniversary, so we won't be touching it in at least 9 years for the 20th. And by then, who knows who among us will still be on these boards, or even still be reading comics for that matter. ;)

Besides, part of DC's main identity is that they're the most diverse comic publisher. It'd be a kind of injustice to celebrate just the DCU without DC's other imprints -- especially considering that the "birth" of the publisher had characters more akin to Vertigo/Beyond the DCU rather than those associated with DCU superheroes and other characters, who only came along years later.

We did consider making separate lists for separate imprints, but decided one unified list would be more thought-provoking.

tormented_spawn
Feb 14, 2005, 08:23 pm
that depends...who the hell is Jesse Cluster? to play devil's advocate, Robin is a far more iconic character than Jesse Custer. a penchant for whiskey and a tendency to solve your problems with head butting only goes so far. :p

Black Lightning is DC's Black Panther in so far as, well, they're both black characters. And they're both into politics. beyond that, i don't see where you're drawing the comparison.

and how much Vertigo have you read that you don't know who Zatanna is? Hey, i love Jenny Sparks and all, but Z takes the cake.

oops, darn spelling mistake...it was late.

Oh, you fanboys and your crushes. ;) what title does she actually appear (she didn't make one appearance in Animal Man), I'm guessing, "Book of Magic" or ""Magik", right, I guess with all the pull the bunny out the hat stuff in the book and she'll fit right in. Though, Jenny Sparks, kicks more asses and without her, Authority starts to fall apart and last but not least she killed God, GOD!

If this list is about who's the more iconic character then Bugs Bunny should be up there with the Bats, Supes, etc. You, young people and your MTV.

raul grau
Feb 15, 2005, 04:12 am
Oh, you fanboys and your crushes. ;) what title does she actually appear (she didn't make one appearance in Animal Man), I'm guessing, "Book of Magic" or ""Magik", right, I guess with all the pull the bunny out the hat stuff in the book and she'll fit right in. Though, Jenny Sparks, kicks more asses and without her, Authority starts to fall apart and last but not least she killed God, GOD!

Well, to start with, yes, she was in Books of Magic (in all of its incarnations, including the current one). She is also an ex-girlfriend of John Constantine, which has earned her quite a few appearances in Hellblazer. She was in Swamp Thing (both during the pre-Vertigo Alan Moore days, and after), briefly had a Vertigo mini, and has shown up in nearly every book that had anything to do with magic... and those are just her Vertigo appearances.

No, there is no bunny-pulling in any Tim Hunter book (wait, I amend that, there was one incident of bunny-pulling, but the bunnies were dead, as was the magician). I only mentioned that style of stage 'magic' to illustrate how very different Tim is from that world. His series was about a boy, who just so happened to have great power, and who usually found a way to get by without using any magic at all. I highly recommend the original BOM mini by Neil Gaiman, if for no other reason that it features some of the best comic painters of the early 90s.

Jenny Sparks is a fine character. She was also an Image character until quite recently, and then became a dead character, so I would imagine that those factors hurt her stance in the rankings.

I guess I'll just chalk the Tim thing down to taste but as Starman is one of my favourite comics of all time and as Buddy Baker is the most likeable superhero ever written I guess I was a little.... annoyed that someone I actively dislike beat them both out.

Hey, as you probably can guess, I'm a bit of a Jack Knight fan myself, but I think there is room for both characters... obviously I do, as I wrote both their entries. Of course, I would have liked to have seen both place much higher, but that is what happens when you let people other than yourself vote. ;)

- Raul

Dylan McKay
Feb 15, 2005, 04:20 am
Hey, as you probably can guess, I'm a bit of a Jack Knight fan myself, but I think there is room for both characters... obviously I do, as I wrote both their entries. Of course, I would have liked to have seen both place much higher, but that is what happens when you let people other than yourself vote. ;)

- Raul

I still say Myra Fermin belongs on this list...

Phoenix_Force
Feb 15, 2005, 05:19 am
Oooh, it's a deep burn!

You rated Judge Dredd above Jenny Sparks? :frust:

And Tim Hunter above Preacher?

And Zatanna is not even in the top thirty? Ouch, kids. Ouch.

I like this list, but the ordering is all whacky to me. Oh well; it's all subjective.

tormented_spawn
Feb 15, 2005, 08:43 am
Well, to start with, yes, she was in Books of Magic (in all of its incarnations, including the current one). She is also an ex-girlfriend of John Constantine, which has earned her quite a few appearances in Hellblazer. She was in Swamp Thing (both during the pre-Vertigo Alan Moore days, and after), briefly had a Vertigo mini, and has shown up in nearly every book that had anything to do with magic... and those are just her Vertigo appearances.

Jenny Sparks is a fine character. She was also an Image character until quite recently, and then became a dead character, so I would imagine that those factors hurt her stance in the rankings.

I'm going to get my ass kick here, never read one issue of Hellblazer. Please be gentle with me. Sadly, only read one trade of Swamp Thing. Also, read Book of Magic before, never got me interested.

Bet Jenny can kick Zantanna's ass? ;)

bravelybravesirrobin
Feb 15, 2005, 10:41 am
rebbur sevolg - should stop Jenny Sparks.

Roberto Polanco
Feb 15, 2005, 02:58 pm
I can only laugh at your desicion to put Daffy and Bugs in this list. Come on kids, they're just as large icons as superman and batman, and NOT comicbook characters. If you'll use every Warner character ever made, put Humphrey Bogart as Rick Blaine from Casablanca . . . . sheesh

captainmarveljr
Feb 15, 2005, 03:52 pm
Yay! Glad to see some Adam Strange love.

Jordan T. Maxwell
Feb 15, 2005, 04:05 pm
V v 1984

Both are set in england, set in a "near future" at the time of writing deal with an oppressive government that constantly watches you (Moore made a big deal of security cameras appearing, which of course is reality now) uses hatred in order to inspire loyalty and both have a Big Brother figure telling everyone how good the government is all the time.

In both stories the hero is an anarchist (and yes they both are "I hate virtue, I hate purity, I want everyone corrupt" and the promises to kill children etc, etc upon joining the brotherhood clearly mark Wilson out as anarchist) who doesn't so much want to build a new world as much as destroy the current one. V is a very different kind of hero (in that he's Doctor Doom, the intelligent all knowing physical and mental behemoth who hides his face) but he's also a lot less real and engaging because of it (I suppose a case could be amde that as V is jsut a persona that was kind of the point)

The major difference is that V takes on a successor and has a "happy" ending with the anarchy achieved and the possibility of a better world emerging whereas 1984 has a dour ending that doesn't provide a power fantasy and isntead forces the reader to confront his own reality.

There a many subtle differences too (the communist system creates proles and a caste system built on denial whereas the faschists have a more normal undersociety of criminals corrupt coppers and druggies), Moore is no hack and he didn't rip off 1984 by any means but I don't think V says anything new. It's the same themes just with an ending that promises hope.

there are of course going to be some thematic similarities between V and 1984...but then you could also throw Brave New World, A Handmaid's Tale and Bladerunner in and see many of the same similarities. they're common themes of the dystopia genre. The book's plot and characters follow such incredibly divergent lines compared to Orwell's work. For one thing, i disagree with your characterization of Winston as an anarchist. The entire point of Winston's character is that he has no ideology, he has no commitment, he's a selfish malcontent who doesn't care whether society or even he as an individual as free. Anarchy does not want everyone to be corrupt and foul, it doesn't want to kill children...as V says, the end goal is to produce ordnung, voluntary order. A citizenry taking responsibility and authority for itself and keeping order without the need for institutional laws. V wants to restore freedom, culture, diversity. Not merely to destroy the old world, but to clear the way for something newer and better to be created. He wants there to be roses again. The Party in Oceania controls the citizenry through fear and discontentment. They want people to not trust one another, they want people to be so unhappy that a few will rebel in order to create an enemy of the state that can generate yet more fear. it's part of their system. Norsefire just wants to keep people under its control, with no grander conspiracy beyond that. Another very important difference, at least in the thought processes of the writers, is that Orwell intended his novel to be more a parable for the times he was living in. the original title of the book was 1948, whereas Moore's is and was always intended to be more of a sci fi political pulp thriller set in a possible future (where England becomes fascist in the wake of WWIII, NOT where Germany beats England in WWII...sorry, keep hearing that particular error as it appears to be what the movie is going to claim. ugh). And i don't agree with the notion that the Party will always control in 1984...i'm less cynical than Orwell, i suppose, but even he wrote it as a cautionary tale, commenting in a newspaper when it was released "Don't let this happen. It's up to you." Winston could not bring the Party down...but that's the point of Winston. He's a tragic and pathetic figure with little redeeming quality. We're meant to root for him and sympathize with him, but by the end you realize he's a selfish and small minded man. Totally unlike V, Evey and Finch.

Animal Man is above Hawkman and Jay Garrick? That just doesn't make sense. They were some of the first superheroes. And if we're going to add WB characters, Bugs Bunny would go up there with Superman and Batman in the top 3.

I'm not real fond of all these DC events here, to be honest. Especially with the inclusion of Warner Brothers characters.

I thought this would be just DC, no Vertigo or WB. When Vertigo reaches a big anniversary year I bet we see a Vertigo top something or another. It's a double dip.

no, it's really not. We already missed the tenth anniversary, and we tend to like to celebrate things in tens here at the site. and Vertigo is part of DC. those particular Warner Bros. characters are published by DC. This is a celebration of DC. Not just your limited notion of it.

and you have a problem with WB characters being a part of this event...yet want Bugs Bunny in the top 3? and i can't speak for everyone else, but Animal Man ranked higher in my voting than either of those Golden Age characters because even just with Morrison's run, he was a far more interesting and engaging character than either of those gents. No knock against them, they deserve their place on this list. But i agree with having Animal Man ranked higher.

I'm going to get my ass kick here, never read one issue of Hellblazer. Please be gentle with me. Sadly, only read one trade of Swamp Thing. Also, read Book of Magic before, never got me interested.

Bet Jenny can kick Zantanna's ass? ;)

dead girl with electric powers versus live girl who can affect reality on a fundamental level just by talking backwards...i'm gonna give that match to Z. now, Jenny Quantum when she grows up versus Z...then we'll have a match.

I can only laugh at your desicion to put Daffy and Bugs in this list. Come on kids, they're just as large icons as superman and batman, and NOT comicbook characters. If you'll use every Warner character ever made, put Humphrey Bogart as Rick Blaine from Casablanca . . . . sheesh

well, sadly, Casablanca has never been a comic book (though i think it'd make a great noirish kind of graphic novel...get Azzarello or Rucka to write it, throw in either Steve Lieber or Lee Berjmejo for artwork. be brilliant) so it's not really eligible for consideration. And even if it were, Lieutenant Renau would have to win out as the better character to include. :p

Bugs and Daffy on the other hand ARE comic book characters in that they are characters who have been featured in a comic book. so your argument is inherently flawed.

Phoenix_Force
Feb 15, 2005, 04:22 pm
I would have to agree with Jordan; Z would beat Jenny's ass in a fight any day.

I'm still waiting for the Alex Ross proposed "fishnet buddies" series with she and Dinah. :]

NMBradbury
Feb 15, 2005, 06:13 pm
Originally Posted by a bunch of people
Zatanna would beat Jenny's ass in a fight any day.

Yes, Zatanna can alter reality with a few reverse words, but would she be able to think of how to pronounce the words backwards and actually say them before Jenny electrocuted her? I think not! Anyway, Jesse Custer could beat them both anyday. ;)

tormented_spawn
Feb 15, 2005, 08:29 pm
dead girl with electric powers versus live girl who can affect reality on a fundamental level just by talking backwards...i'm gonna give that match to Z. now, Jenny Quantum when she grows up versus Z...then we'll have a match.

Exactly, Bradbury. Now assuming that Jenny is alive and comes face-to-face with Z, well, seeing from the smash hit "Identity Crisis" in issue #3, Deathstroke manage to stop Z from casting a spell, now we know he's fast. Now, I'm not one of 'em scientist guys, but lightning is damn fast and Jenny can strike Z, before she can utter a complete sentence. I'll go with Jenny, unless Z brings in Superman with her. :]

Now, let's move on from who will win and go back to the list. Will #1 will be either be Supes or Batman? If so, I think the comixfan community will be divided on this one and start an all out war with this.

Lisa Charly
Feb 15, 2005, 08:59 pm
After reading this lest, I'll most definitely be looking into V for Vendetta and Stormwatch.

Al Harahap
Feb 15, 2005, 09:37 pm
Re: Jenny Sparks vs. Zatanna...

I don't know how it turned into a Holodeck fight -- personally, I think Jenny's the better combatant on the field -- but the point is that (at least to me) Zatanna's higher on the list because she's the ultimate supporting character who fits perfectly anywhere from a DCU superhero story to a Vertigo horror story and everything in between. And she does so quite regularly. That isn't a comfort zone any other character can boast quite as well. :zatanna:

Now, let's move on from who will win and go back to the list. Will #1 will be either be Supes or Batman? If so, I think the comixfan community will be divided on this one and start an all out war with this.

But... how do you know #1's not Ambush Bug? :shhh:

Dylan McKay
Feb 15, 2005, 10:02 pm
Exactly, Bradbury. Now assuming that Jenny is alive and comes face-to-face with Z, well, seeing from the smash hit "Identity Crisis" in issue #3, Deathstroke manage to stop Z from casting a spell, now we know he's fast. Now, I'm not one of 'em scientist guys, but lightning is damn fast and Jenny can strike Z, before she can utter a complete sentence. I'll go with Jenny, unless Z brings in Superman with her. :]

Now, let's move on from who will win and go back to the list. Will #1 will be either be Supes or Batman? If so, I think the comixfan community will be divided on this one and start an all out war with this.

The difference is that Deathstroke uses 90% of his brain simultaniously, and thus thinks faster than everyone else. So it's more than just physical speed.

That said, it isn't so cut and dry that Z wins everytime, but I'd say more often than not because Jenny needs first strike to win.

I still say we should have gone with my original idea for #1 on the list, but I can't say who that would be because said character hasn't appeared yet. It would have been a brilliant swerve if ya ask me.

Ken Boehm
Feb 15, 2005, 10:46 pm
The way this voting has gone in this, I wouldn't be suprised if Flex Mentallo is #1. This is worse than the Ukraine election! :p

EvolutionIceman
Feb 15, 2005, 11:01 pm
Personally, I would put Darkseid in the Top 20, and Tim Drake in the Top 5.

Otherwise, I'm okay with most of this list, aside from Dredd, who doesn't deserve to be one of the Top 70 characters. Bugs should probably be a little higher than 31, but he's okay there.

Scratching my head at the lack of Titans though, there should be some on the next list, hopefully. I don't see how you can ignore character's from the book that pretty much single handedly saved DC in the 80's on a list like this.

Phoenix_Force
Feb 16, 2005, 03:05 am
I consider most of the Titans worthy enough to be in the top 20-30, actually. Well, excluding "Beast Boy." Laaaaaame.

More villains, though! Captain Cold? Clayface? Poison Ivy? Circe?

We shall see . . .

Jordan T. Maxwell
Feb 16, 2005, 04:22 am
Yes, Zatanna can alter reality with a few reverse words, but would she be able to think of how to pronounce the words backwards and actually say them before Jenny electrocuted her? I think not! Anyway, Jesse Custer could beat them both anyday. ;)

she doesn't have to think. she's one of the world's most powerful magicians and just uses the backward speaking technique to focus her incredible powers. so yeah, she'd say any handy dandy spell she had at hand to eliminate Jenny as a threat (though not kill her, just incapacitate).

and both Jenny and Z are women...so Jesse couldn't do a thing by his code. :)

The way this voting has gone in this, I wouldn't be suprised if Flex Mentallo is #1. This is worse than the Ukraine election! :p

um...Flex Mentallo has already appeared on the list. nice try though. ;)

Dylan McKay
Feb 16, 2005, 04:23 am
I think Jesse's code wouldn't stop him from saying, "Stop attacking me."

Jordan T. Maxwell
Feb 16, 2005, 04:25 am
heh, fair enough...though somehow i think the next words out of his mouth would be "now...mud wrestle." :D

Dylan McKay
Feb 16, 2005, 04:28 am
Would be hard to resist, but it would defeat the fishnets...

Angelophile
Feb 16, 2005, 05:51 am
...

Geez, Bugs Bunny, Daffy Duck and Judge Dredd?

Has DC really got such a lack of memorable characters that suddenly Loony Tunes have to be inserted onto the list to make up numbers? That's bad comedy.

What's with all the DC lists and coverage recently anyway? Is the site being turned over to a DC only fandom?

Any when we start talking about Jenny Freakin' Sparks mudwrestling, this site has hit a new low.

tormented_spawn
Feb 16, 2005, 10:22 am
Well, I'm not speaking on their behalf though, I think they can't blend in the Marvel characters with the DC character cause seeing as majority of Comixfan users are Marvel fans the staff will be constantly bombard by "Woverine kicks Batman's tail", etc. etc. and we don't want that to happen to our beloved Comixfan staff.

About the mud wrestling, yeah, they're people too, can't they have fun?

About the list: Will we be seeing any characters from Invisibles? King Mob should be in the list. Hope, no one in their right mind will add in friggin Krypto. :P

Kevin Sutton
Feb 16, 2005, 10:52 am
...
What's with all the DC lists and coverage recently anyway? Is the site being turned over to a DC only fandom?

FEBRUARY 2005: CELEBRATING 70 YEARS OF DC COMICS! (http://www.comixfan.com/xfan/forums/showthread.php?t=32203)

NMBradbury
Feb 16, 2005, 01:54 pm
No. 1? I reckon Superman. Not necessarily because he's the BEST character, in terms of the actual enjoyment I get out of reading a Superman comic (I still enjoy a good Supes comic, you understand, just not as much as comics starring other characters) but because he's the most important. He was the first real superhero, and it's mostly thanks to him we actually call them SUPERheroes (I think).
Having said that, most of the characters I predicted for top 10 glory are already gone, so.... I may not be the most reliable bet.

And I think Jenny's cooler than Zatanna, whether she could win in a fight or not.

Jordan T. Maxwell
Feb 16, 2005, 08:10 pm
...

Geez, Bugs Bunny, Daffy Duck and Judge Dredd?

Has DC really got such a lack of memorable characters that suddenly Loony Tunes have to be inserted onto the list to make up numbers? That's bad comedy.

no, but as we're including ALL Of DC's imprints in this event, that means that the nominations and voting were open to any and all characters featured in a comic book that has been published by DC. This includes the Looney Tunes, the Power Puff Girls, the Scooby Gang (original, not Whedon), any characters from the 2000 AD comics they've published, Humanoids, CMX, Vertigo, Wildstorm, Homage...and when you take all those into account, there's a whole hell of a lot more than just seventy worthwhile characters.


What's with all the DC lists and coverage recently anyway? Is the site being turned over to a DC only fandom?

um...no. why would we do that? The name of the site is Comix-Fan, as in all comics. the fact that we used to be solely dedicated to X-Men coverage is an albatross we still have to bear so why on earth would we take a step backwards in that regard by making ourselves exclusive to another publisher, imprint or franchise? In case you haven't noticed over the last couple of weeks, we're celebrating DC's 70th Anniversary this month (as we celebrated the X-Men and Avengers 40th anniversaries back in '03).


Any when we start talking about Jenny Freakin' Sparks mudwrestling, this site has hit a new low.

have you BEEN to the Holodeck? :p

Well, I'm not speaking on their behalf though, I think they can't blend in the Marvel characters with the DC character cause seeing as majority of Comixfan users are Marvel fans the staff will be constantly bombard by "Woverine kicks Batman's tail", etc. etc. and we don't want that to happen to our beloved Comixfan staff.

About the mud wrestling, yeah, they're people too, can't they have fun?

About the list: Will we be seeing any characters from Invisibles? King Mob should be in the list. Hope, no one in their right mind will add in friggin Krypto. :P

i don't want to comment on the upcoming remaining characters as there are some surprises (and disappointments) in store. but i think when the entire event is over and taken as a whole, you'll see that just about everyone and everything (with rare exceptions) got recognition.

except for Krypto. He is indeed lame.


And I think Jenny's cooler than Zatanna, whether she could win in a fight or not.

i can't say one's cooler than the other. i love them both for very different reasons. white jackets and fishnets are both sexy though. ;)

Dylan McKay
Feb 16, 2005, 08:21 pm
except for Krypto. He is indeed lame.


Krypto is so lame that he's as far removed from lame in the negative direction as WE3 is removed in the possitive direction...

Jordan T. Maxwell
Feb 16, 2005, 11:22 pm
yeah...Bandit would kick Krypto's ass.

(i'll avoid any mentions of mud wrestling this time around) :p

Roberto Polanco
Feb 17, 2005, 01:07 pm
well, sadly, Casablanca has never been a comic book (though i think it'd make a great noirish kind of graphic novel...get Azzarello or Rucka to write it, throw in either Steve Lieber or Lee Berjmejo for artwork. be brilliant) so it's not really eligible for consideration. And even if it were, Lieutenant Renau would have to win out as the better character to include. :p

Bugs and Daffy on the other hand ARE comic book characters in that they are characters who have been featured in a comic book. so your argument is inherently flawed.


well, sure, Casablanca wasn't a funnybook, and the argument is flawed, but that ain't the point. My point is, that if you will put those legendary characters in the list, why put 'em in at all if they'll be so low? I mean, Those are icons that are way bigger than any DC character, with the exception of Bats and Supes.

Jordan T. Maxwell
Feb 17, 2005, 02:10 pm
well, sure, Casablanca wasn't a funnybook, and the argument is flawed, but that ain't the point. My point is, that if you will put those legendary characters in the list, why put 'em in at all if they'll be so low? I mean, Those are icons that are way bigger than any DC character, with the exception of Bats and Supes.

because they're not as big as comic book characters, and that's what we were considering. please, if we were considering character incarnations from across all media...Judge Dredd wouldn't even have made the list with that crap ass movie with Stallone. it was hard to separate the characters themselves from their comic book counterparts...so while their iconic heft leant them enough credence to make the list, it was not considered wholly since it has little to do with them as DC characters.

Cyberman
Feb 18, 2005, 04:07 pm
This is a cool list, although I have a hunch that the popularity of a character affects their place on the list (that- and their role in the DCU. Otherwise the list'd be dominated by Looney Tunes.)

A list of thirty characters who haven't appeared yet,and could easily be in the top 30.

Dream (Sandman)
Death (Sandman)
Lucifer (Sandman)
Swamp Thing
Abby (Swamp Thing)
Cassidy (Preacher)
Tulip O'Hare (Preacher)
Herr Starr (Preacher)
John Constantine
Superman
Batman
Wonder Woman
Robin (Dick Grayson)
Flash (Barry Allen)
Flash (Wally West)
Green lantern (Kyle Ragner)
Green Lantern (Hal Jordan)
Green Arrow
Alfred
Commissioner Gordon
Barbara Gordon
Joker
Lex Luthor
Two-Face
Catwoman
Aquaman
Martian Manhunter
Mister Hyde (League of Extraordinary Gentlemen)

* edit- I just realized I forgot Ozydamius, and Rorschach of Watchmen

Al Harahap
Feb 18, 2005, 04:25 pm
This is a cool list, although I have a hunch that the popularity of a character affects their place on the list (that- and their role in the DCU.

Well, we went for iconability, which I suppose overlaps with popularity, but the latter is certainly not what we focused on. And yes, for DCU and Vertigo characters, their holistic role in the DCU certainly had an effect. Of course, these are just two of a handful of other criteria that have been mentioned across the board.

Dylan McKay
Feb 19, 2005, 01:12 am
This is a cool list, although I have a hunch that the popularity of a character affects their place on the list (that- and their role in the DCU. Otherwise the list'd be dominated by Looney Tunes.)


Good list, there...

There's really no clear way to determine how the list was made, every voter had different criteria. For example, for me, those who are/were unique or that created a new archetype were given high votes while popularity wasn't a factor. I had Black Lightning top ten, where as I had a character who hasn't appeared yet at #67. So everyone tackled the definition of "top characters" in their own way.

And looking over the voting, it's interesting to see Bugs Bunny's votes, seeing as his inclussion is a contested issue, all votes for him on the final list were either top ten, or bottom ten...

I hope I'm not saying too much, but I just think this list is so cool that I want to talk about it.

UltimateFan
Feb 19, 2005, 01:27 am
Wait, I'm confused. Are we considering what status these characters have in comics, or their overall iconality? It won't affect the top of the list, but it does affect it here. If we are considering the iconic level the characters have in comics, Bugs and Daffy shouldn't be on the list at all. (Alfred E. Newman, who was in Part 1, can stay since really, all his popularity and iconality come from MAD.) But if we are focusing on overall iconality, Bugs at least should be in the top 5, and Daffy possibly in the top 10. But I've heard both mentioned as driving forces in this thread alone.

Porky's Hare Hunt the first appearance of Bugs Bunny? Don't tell the people who built his legend for 20+ years. Most animation scholars will dismiss anything prior to Tex Avery's A Wild Hare as being a proto-Bugs not even related to the real thing. In particular, "Animation historian Joe Adamson counts A Wild Hare as the first Bugs Bunny short, with the previous shorts being different one-off bunnies bearing only coincidental resemblance to Bugs." I enter into evidence: "Bugs' true personality would then emerge in Tex Avery's A Wild Hare, first released on July 27, 1940. It was in this cartoon that he first emerged from his rabbit hole to ask Elmer Fudd, now a hunter, "What's up, Doc?" It is considered the first fully developed appearance of the character" (both quotes from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bugs_Bunny). I agree... watch any pre-Wild Hare cartoon and tell me that's the same Bugs Bunny. Heck, I'd personally dismiss Elmer's Pet Rabbit even though it came after Wild Hare and showed the character's name right there on screen.

Just wanted to let you know that there is some controversy on this... please don't use it to drag the thread FURTHER off-topic!

Jordan T. Maxwell
Feb 19, 2005, 01:42 am
Wait, I'm confused. Are we considering what status these characters have in comics, or their overall iconality? It won't affect the top of the list, but it does affect it here. If we are considering the iconic level the characters have in comics, Bugs and Daffy shouldn't be on the list at all. (Alfred E. Newman, who was in Part 1, can stay since really, all his popularity and iconality come from MAD.) But if we are focusing on overall iconality, Bugs at least should be in the top 5, and Daffy possibly in the top 10. But I've heard both mentioned as driving forces in this thread alone.


um...pretty sure i've already said a couple of times that we were really only considering their incarnations as comic book characters. now, their overall iconic status may have colored other's votes or biased them entirely, but personally i ranked them as pretty much dead last on my list...one, because i've never read a comic book with them in it so can't really make an informed vote for them anywhere else and two, because i wouldn't have nominated them for the list in the first place. but the fact is that no, these are NOT the cartoon Bugs and Daffy. They are their comic book counterparts. The earlier entry for Grant Morrison is no reflection on Grant as a writer, but solely on him as a character in a DC comic. If the Power Puff Girls or Scooby Doo Gang show up on the list, it will be as their comic book counterparts, NOT as the original cartoon characters. If God Allmighty Jehovah Yahweh Alpha and Omega Creator of All the Word the Light and the Glory shows up on this list, it will be as the character in Preacher or Lucifer or any other title where He has shown up...NOT as the actual deity. We all well and clear on this now? Or is my blasphemy in vain? ;)

tormented_spawn
Feb 19, 2005, 04:02 am
A list of thirty characters who haven't appeared yet,and could easily be in the top 30.

Good list though, you are telling me Tulip, Cassidy and Starr should be higher on the list than Jesse? Mister Hyde? What about Quartermain? And Alfred, he's like the equivalent of Jeeves or whatever his name is (you know that Butler for Avengers). Well, Alfred is no doubt more recognisble than him. Lastly, you forgot to add someone in The Invisibles, what's The Invisibles you say? OMG, I'm not even going to answer that...

Jordan T. Maxwell
Feb 19, 2005, 05:11 am
worry not...the Invisibles will get their love. oh yes, they will...:cool:

(and it's Quatermain :P)

Jon Hancock
Feb 20, 2005, 07:35 am
Wait, I'm confused. Are we considering what status these characters have in comics, or their overall iconality? It won't affect the top of the list, but it does affect it here. If we are considering the iconic level the characters have in comics, Bugs and Daffy shouldn't be on the list at all. (Alfred E. Newman, who was in Part 1, can stay since really, all his popularity and iconality come from MAD.) But if we are focusing on overall iconality, Bugs at least should be in the top 5, and Daffy possibly in the top 10. But I've heard both mentioned as driving forces in this thread alone.

Porky's Hare Hunt the first appearance of Bugs Bunny? Don't tell the people who built his legend for 20+ years. Most animation scholars will dismiss anything prior to Tex Avery's A Wild Hare as being a proto-Bugs not even related to the real thing. In particular, "Animation historian Joe Adamson counts A Wild Hare as the first Bugs Bunny short, with the previous shorts being different one-off bunnies bearing only coincidental resemblance to Bugs." I enter into evidence: "Bugs' true personality would then emerge in Tex Avery's A Wild Hare, first released on July 27, 1940. It was in this cartoon that he first emerged from his rabbit hole to ask Elmer Fudd, now a hunter, "What's up, Doc?" It is considered the first fully developed appearance of the character" (both quotes from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bugs_Bunny). I agree... watch any pre-Wild Hare cartoon and tell me that's the same Bugs Bunny. Heck, I'd personally dismiss Elmer's Pet Rabbit even though it came after Wild Hare and showed the character's name right there on screen.

Just wanted to let you know that there is some controversy on this... please don't use it to drag the thread FURTHER off-topic!

Yeah, I found Wild Hare as being a first appearance but also found Porky's Hare Hunt. I just went for the first chronologically.

As for the criteria. There's lots more than just iconic status. And to be fair, Bugs and Daffy's fame in cartoons lends lots to their comic book characters as it boosts fan interest and sales.